I am in the process of figuring out if thinkBIGsites.com organic search engine optimization program is worth $2K or $3K a month.
Maybe you are too.
I figure the best way to do this is to evaluate the work they did for one of their reference clients, Frank Key, who sells a colloidal silver product. (This is good because it’s the same industry as my company, Jigsaw Health, working to optimize for magnesium supplements.)
(Images from The Secret To Internet Marketing That Actually Works pdf download.)
So…How Do You Check Inbound Links?
Links to your website with your keywords in the “anchor text” is what Google ranking is mostly based on. Everyone gets that, right? Ok good.
I needed to figure out how to check Frank’s inbound links. Here’s what I did:
Step 1) Googled “How to check inbound links”
Step 2) Got totally lost for like 2 hours.
Thus, Step 2 will be the subject of a future post called “How Do you Check Inbound Links?” because this was not nearly as easy as I wanted it to be would have imagined.
I couldn’t find a single service that reported inbound links grouped by unique domain. They all just showed every page that linked to the target domain.
They were showing me millions of pine needles. I wanted to see the trees.
Of the tools I tested out, Backlinkwatch seemed the best. (Found from this list of 10 Backlink Checking Tools.) It found 1133 links. Wow…sounds awesome!
Of course, what is confusing is that Yahoo!’s site explorer tool only showed 15 inbound links, and Google shows “about 29.” WTF? Don’t you just love data discrepancy?!?! Grrr…
Next Step: Reference Check
The sales rep at ThinkBIGsites I talked with this afternoon is going to let me talk to some reference clients. I’ll share what I learn from them in a future post or an update to this post. More to come…
What’s A Boy To Do?
Get high with a little help from my friends. (Pun intended…like Gaylord Focker, I pass on grass. Always.)
Chase Granberry — of Authority Labs website tracker fame — recommended I check out SEOmoz, MajesticSEO, and SlingshotSEO. I’ll take a look and report back.
Any other comments, please post them. “I want to get high, so-o-o-o-o high.” 
UPDATE: May 18, 2011
I should have updated this post a year ago, but I just never got around to it. In the past year, I’ve answered several personal emails asking, “So how did it turn out with ThinkBIGsites? I’m thinking of using them, but wanted to get your opinion.”
Well, here’s the rest of the story that I wrote back to all of those who emailed me…
ThinkBigSites did get all 5 of my keywords on the first page, in the time that they expected to do it. One keyword, “magnesium calcium supplement”, was up to 2nd place for a month.
But once I analyzed the traffic, there were only about 100 visits from that natural ranking, and only 1 converted into being a customer.
I’ve done more conversion optimization and multi-variant testing than the average bear, of that I can assure you. In fact, I was a case study in Bryan Eisenberg’s Always Be Testing: The Complete Guide to Google Website Optimizer.
Did I have a conversion problem? Yes. And what this trial with ThinkBigSites made me realize — once again — is that “persuassive momentum” matters more to the conversion process than anything else.
What is persuasive momentum?
It’s the spark that started the fire, or the search. What caused this person to search for “calcium magnesium supplements” in the first place? A doctor. A friend. A newspaper article. Etc.
As a premium priced product, Jigsaw Health doesn’t have a strong chance of getting the business of “generic term searchers”, unless they are in a “slow buying modality” of “humanistic or methodical.”
I reviewed this data with TBS and they agreed with me that it made sense to stop spending money. So I did and we parted ways as friends.
Is First Place Worth It?
I didn’t find “paying to get to first place” to be a worthwhile strategy for Jigsaw Health.
In fact, trying to get and stay at #1 organically is no different than building a house on sand IMO. (Here’s a few more thoughts on first place.)
{ 31 comments }
What was the verdict? Did you chooses them?
Actually, I started with SlingshotSEO on two keywords. But ThinkBigSites ran a promo at the end of December that was too good not to pass up, so I went with them as well for five keywords. Currently comparing the progress of both. And the jury is still out. I’ll report when I’ve got something concrete.
I’d be interested in hearing about your experience with ThinkBigSites. I have a client that is really unhappy with some of their tactics.
Any updates on ThinkBig? I ran across a business piece featuring them on one of the cable news channels (Inside Business). Interesting players.
Dee, I’m not positive, but I’m pretty sure that TV piece you saw was paid-for-production and pay-for-play. I’ve been approached to do those before from companies in Florida that charge about $5,000. It looks nice, but it’s not “real” journalism. Just an infomercial basically.
That said, I did elect to start using ThinkBIG. Thus far, the jury is still out on results. But they have been pleasant to work with. I’ll update in a few months.
[redacted, per Matt's request since ThinkBig resolved the matter with his friend Linda and refunded 100% of her money.]
Matt – and any others – I am considering working with ThinkbigSites and would appreciate knowing the nature of your disagreement/frustration with them and whether you’ve been able to reach any resolution to the problem?
Mike, for what it’s worth, so far I’m pretty happy with ThinkBIG. I’ve been reviewing their work and I’m not jumping up and down ecstatic, but it’s ok, and affordable. Will keep everyone apprised of my progress.
[redacted]
[redacted, per Linda's request since ThinkBig resolved the matter and refunded 100% of her money.]
I’m surprised at the negative reviews of ThinkBIG that are showing up here. I’ve been using them for almost 3 months and so far, my results have been positive.
In fact, I had talked with someone yesterday at ThinkBIG who was checking to see how the process was going so far. I said, “Your ‘new customer process’ was very smooth, everyone I’ve worked with has been really helpful, and I like the results I’m seeing so far… But… I’m not ready for a ringing endorsement yet. I’d consider myself cautiously optimistic, and still waiting to see where we end up in a few months. But I’m still a paying customer.”
[redacted, per Matt's request since ThinkBig resolved the matter with his friend Linda and refunded 100% of her money.]
Matt, you obviously still have an axe to grind. Ok. I get it. I’ve been there before, too. Believe me!
However, I have to say that my experience has not reflected yours at all. Maybe when you signed up as a client, they had some broken processes or bad employees in place that they’ve since been fixed or fired when I became a client in Dec 2010.
My take: When a vendor-client relationship goes south, if the client can make a reasonable argument for why their expectations weren’t met, it’s in the vendor’s best interest to make things right for the client. Standing behind “terms of use” policies or supposed iron-clad “30 day money back guarantees only” are stupid because it will bite you in the ass.
In today’s world, everyone is a potential publisher of their story with your company. And google will find that needle, no matter where it is in the haystack.
Matt, I’ll forward your comments to my contact at ThinkBig so hopefully they can take care of your complaints.
I don’t want to get caught in the middle here but my brother and I are both ThinkBIG clients as well.
We signed on a few months ago (same deal Patrick got) and so far so good. We were emailed and called several times regarding our campaign. I must say that any delays we incurred were our fault. I dd my research before signing up with them and found nothing bad at all.
Matt/Linda,
Did they provide you with keyword research? Did they start linking for you? Did they optimize your site?
Any way they did all of the above for us. Here’s how it went down for those interested.
First, they did a pretty good keyword analysis for us
Second, once I chose my keywords (about 2 weeks later)they began linking to site. I got the first linking report back from them about a month and half of signing on.
Third, after keywords were picked and linking was underway, they optimized my site and gave us some new content.
Is that how it worked for you Patrick???
Linda, who designed and manages your site now?
Peter, yeah, that’s the exact same process I went through. Quite frankly, I thought their “new customer on-boarding” experience was one of the best I’ve ever been a part of. It was very smooth, and any delays were my fault.
[redacted, per Linda's request since ThinkBig resolved the matter and refunded 100% of her money.]
At this point, since they took money and had done absolutely nothing I want my money back.
[redacted]
Hello Folks,
Marc here. Thought I would clear the air here once and for all.
The assertions made here are not true. We did in fact refund Linda one months worth of payments of the 2 that she made . Linda even responded to the refund email she received (see below). The reason we refunded the money was because Matt (who is NOT our customer)called in to our SEO department yelling, making threats and demanding we return 100% of his friends money NOW!!!!
If you look further down, I have included the ENTIRE email thread between ThinkBIG and Linda’s company. It is very clear that a Keyword Analysis was completed and understood by the client. It is also very clear that linking had started. Just as we asked the client for ftp access to their site in order to begin the optimization portion of the project, we were contacted by Matt who derailed the entire project and has done nothing but slander my name and threaten me.
Also, as Peter and Patrick are aware, it is IMPOSSIBLE to order ANY of our campaigns with out agreeing to our Terms of Service
. Which Tim and Linda clearly did as well.
Regarding me defending our company’s name and reputation, rest assured I will not get pushed around in this fashion. We did everything in our power to make this work for Linda and her company.
******************************************
From: linda hayes [mailto:lindasarahhayes@yahoo.com]
Sent: Thursday, March 11, 2010 2:58 PM
To: Michael Sanginario
Subject: Re: THINK BIG SITES.COM Customer Refund Notification
If you need to talk to me, my phone number is 206-244-xxxx
Linda Hayes
Hayes Heating
— On Tue, 3/9/10, Michael Sanginario wrote:
From: Michael Sanginario
Subject: THINK BIG SITES.COM Customer Refund Notification
To: “Linda Hayes”
Date: Tuesday, March 9, 2010, 7:51 AM ========= GENERAL INFORMATION =========
Merchant : THINK BIG SITES.COM
Date/Time : 09-Mar-2010 08:51:00 AM
Transaction ID : 2882970850
========= ORDER INFORMATION =========
Type : REFUND
*******************************************
Email thread discussing keyword analysis and the start of linking.
—–Original Message—–
From: dcalandra@thinkbigsites.com
Sent: Wednesday, February 10, 2010 5:50 PM
To: Andrew Arner; service@hayesheating.com
Subject: RE: Final keyword recommendation for http://www.hayesheating.com
Hey Tim,
Now that you’ve chosen your phrases, I’ve sent your info to Jason Hagelberg.
Jason will be calling you soon to get the On Page SEO started.
If you have any questions, please feel free to call or e-mail.
Thanks,
Dominick
Dominick Calandra
VP of Client Relations
Direct – 631-410-4562
HQ – 888-300-1496
dcalandra@thinkbigsites.com
http://www.thinkBIGsites.com
http://www.domthinksbig.com
From: Andrew Arner [mailto:aarner@thinkbigsites.com]
Sent: Wednesday, February 10, 2010 3:03 PM
To: service@hayesheating.com
Cc: Sheila Dahlstrom; Dominick Calandra
Subject: Re: Final keyword recommendation for http://www.hayesheating.com
Tim,
To confirm, we will go with these 5…
Seattle heating
Seattle water heater
Seattle furnace
Seattle furnace repair
Seattle boiler
Andrew Arner
ThinkBIGSites.com
Direct – 631.223.4184
Cellular – 917-226-2673
aarner@thinkbigsites.com
http://www.thinkBIGsites.com
________________________________________
From: Andy Arner
Date: Mon, 01 Feb 2010 10:52:54 -0500
To: “service@hayesheating.com”
Cc: Sheila Dahlstrom
Conversation: Final keyword recomendation for http://www.hayesheating.com
Subject: FW: Final keyword recomendation for http://www.hayesheating.com
Tim, have you had a chance to review? Please let me know if you would like to discuss.
Thanks,
Andy
Andrew Arner
ThinkBIGSites.com
Direct – 631.223.4184
Cellular – 917-226-2673
aarner@thinkbigsites.com
http://www.thinkBIGsites.com
—— Forwarded Message
From: Andy Arner
Date: Tue, 26 Jan 2010 15:28:42 -0500
To: “service@hayesheating.com”
Cc: Dominick Calandra , Sheila Dahlstrom
Conversation: Final keyword recomendation for http://www.hayesheating.com
Subject: Final keyword recomendation for http://www.hayesheating.com
Tim,
Attached you will find our keyword research for http://www.hayesheating.com
Included in the spreadsheet you will see:
Column A – Keyword phrase
Column B – Monthly Search volume according to Google (you should expect more when considering traffic from the other search engines)
Column C – Difficulty – This is a weighted level of difficulty pulled from a tool that considers Allintitle and Allinanchor (who has the keyword in their page title AND anchor text)
Column D and E – Your current placement, if any, in Google (results vary depending on the datacenter pulled from)
Column F and G – Your current placement, if any, in Yahoo
Column H and I – Your current placement, if any, in Live
When choosing keywords I always look at:
Search volume
Conversion consideration (after our discussion)
Current rankings
Difficulty Level (and what the competition is doing)
Budget/Package
Based on the local phrases, these looked to be the best in my opinion in regards to volume. Please let me know if you are ok to proceed with these terms. Feel free to call or email if you have any questions.
Andrew Arner
ThinkBIGSites.com
Direct – 631.223.4184
Cellular – 917-226-2673
aarner@thinkbigsites.com
http://www.thinkBIGsites.com
> From: Andy Arner
> Date: Mon, 18 Jan 2010 12:40:55 -0500
> To: “service@hayesheating.com”
> Cc: Dominick Calandra , Sheila Dahlstrom
> , Jenny Bradley
> Conversation: Recap: Call to discuss keywords for http://www.hayesheating.com
> Subject: Recap: Call to discuss keywords for http://www.hayesheating.com
>
> Tim, it was nice speaking to you.
>
> To recap our call, below is a list of the core terms will will research for
> the King County area. We will expand the list and come back to you with our
> recommendations.
>
> Gas furnace
> Gas boiler
> Tankless water heater
> Water heater
> Heat pump
>
> Please let me know if there is anything else you would like to include in
> this.
>
> Thanks,
> Andy
>
> —— Original Appointment
>
> From: dcalandra@thinkbigsites.com
>
> When: 12:00 PM – 12:30 PM January 18, 2010
> Subject: Call to discuss keywords for http://www.hayesheating.com
>
>
> When: Monday, January 18, 2010 12:00 PM-12:30 PM (GMT-05:00) Eastern Time (US
> & Canada).
>
> Note: The GMT offset above does not reflect daylight saving time adjustments.
>
> *~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*
>
> Hey Tim,
>
> This is to confirm our call for Monday January 18th, 2010 @ 12pm est. We will
> be discussing keywords for http://www.hayesheating.com. The 2 National Silver
> packages you have purchased, will allow you up to 10 keyword phrases.
>
> The conference call number is 305-848-8888 access code 9104104562.
>
> Thanks and we look forward to speaking with you!
>
> Best regards,
>
> Dominick Calandra
> VP of Client Relations
> Direct – 631-410-4562
> HQ – 888-300-1496
> dcalandra@thinkbigsites.com
> http://www.thinkBIGsites.com
> http://www.domthinksbig.com
>
>
>
>
>
>
> —— End Of Original Appointment
>
—— End of Forwarded Message
Hey Patrick,
Thought this video by Matt Cutts on Google’s back link checker would be interesting to you. Hope this helps. I know it can get confusing.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TjQ2QVQpaK0&feature=channel
[redacted, per Linda's request since ThinkBig resolved the matter and refunded 100% of her money.]
[redacted]
March 15th
Okay, I just called my Visa Co and Think Big Sites DID refund me 75% of their charges. Now if they will refund the rest, I will sing their praises forever and I will try to talk Matt into removing his nasty reviews. I will remove mine. Linda Hayes
—
ed. note: Linda, I’m glad that you were able to get refunded some money for work that you felt wasn’t performed up to your standards. I didn’t like how the comment thread degraded into name calling, so I’ve redacted some of the previous comments that I felt were out of line.
Linda,
As I explained to you and Tim on numerous occasions, I would love to speak you with either of you at any time in a CIVIL manner. Unfortunately the last we spoke, I was cursed and yelled at from “hello”.
Still not sure who Matt is (he told me he was your webmaster),and why he thinks I would speak with him after being threatened and berated from the moment we first spoke.
I will say this, when I did speak with Matt Breeze (http://www.myspace.com/caspercoolbreeze), it was very clear he had little to no understanding of SEO and what was being done for Linda and Tim (Matt if I am mistaken, please share some of your SEO expertise with all of us). The truth is, had Matt not derailed the process in a psychotic rage, you would be well on your way to attaining high rankings. Just like Patrick and Peter A above.
We also noticed you pulled the .com version of your site down (probably Matts’ advice). Not a good idea. All of the links that we placed on your behalf were pointed at the .com version. The next step would have been to add fresh content and optimize the .com version (titles, metas etc..). Google really likes when they crawl a site and can see that the content is being freshened up every now and again. Its at this point in time that our clients see the biggest jump in rankings. Just take a look at the SEM Rush chart here on the left hand side which clearly shows a DRAMATIC spike in your sites traffic which would have continued had Matts’ actions not derailed your campaign.
http://www.semrush.com/search.php?q=www.hayesheating.com+b&db=us&stype=domain
If I were you I would not have Matt make any more decisions and/or changes regarding your site. He is very dangerous as we can all see.
Hey Linda,
After reading this whole thread, I have to say that you & your friend Matt owe this company a tremendous apology!!
That’s one honest business owner to another – Period!!
[redacted, per Linda's request since ThinkBig resolved the matter and refunded 100% of her money.]
[redacted, per Linda's request since ThinkBig resolved the matter and refunded 100% of her money.]
(ed note. This comment from Linda comes after realizing she had been refunded $3000 of $4000 paid to TBS.)
I was going to talk to Matt about completely removing all derogatory remarks about THINKBIG before seeing the post that I should apology to them. Once ThinkBig refunds ALL the money (that they should not have taken in the first place) I will remove my comments. If it weren’t for Matt, I would not have known how you were defrauding me. Get it together people. Don’t charge people money without performing a service!
I don’t even believe the positive reviews on this site are from real customers. They sound like they are employees of the ThinkBig business.
Listen, in a word, JUST REFUND the rest of my money and I will get off your case!!!!!
REFUND THE LAST $1000 OF MY MONEY. REFUND THE LAST $1000 OF MY MONEY
(ed note: ThinkBig did refund the remaining $1000 that Linda felt she was owed. Good on them for looking past “Terms of Use Contracts” and just making things right by the client.)
Linda, this is getting really annoying. If my experience with ThinkBigSites was negative, then I could relate. But honestly, my experience has been positive up to this point, and continues to be positive.
Thus, I’ve redacted several of yours and Matt’s comments.
I would ask that you please email Marc directly marca@thinkbigsites.com and work out the remaining $1,000 that hasn’t been refunded like adults.
For the record, I’m a client of ThinkBig, not an employee.
The comments on this post are now closed. If someone really needs to leave an important comment, use the contact form and send it to me.
UPDATE: Matt emailed me separately and asked me to remove all of his previous comments because the matter had been cleared up, ThinkBig had refunded 100% of Linda’s payments.
[redacted, per Linda's request since ThinkBig resolved the matter and refunded 100% of her money.]
Comments on this entry are closed.
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